IS JESUS SAYING HE HIMSELF IS
GREAT I AM THAT I AM ?
Does John 8:58 prove the the doctrine of the trinity, which states that Jesus the Son of God is CO ETERNAL with Almighty God? Or does John 8:58 prove the doctrine of the deity of Jesus as himself being ALMIGHTY God the great I AM THAT I AM, which we read about in Exodus 3:14, which says,
“And God said unto Moses, I AM THAT I AM: and he said, Thus shall you say unto the children of Israel, I AM has sent me unto you.”
In John 8:58 Jesus says, Verily verily, BEFORE Abraham was, I AM. So the question has been asked, “Is Jesus saying he IS THE I AM, as in, Is Jesus saying that he is THE ALMIGHTY God, when Jesus says the words “I AM”?”
Then another question is asked, “Does Jesus saying the words “I AM” mean that Jesus pre existed for all eternity like Almighty God? In other words, was Jesus as the SON of Almighty God ALWAYS in existence WITH Almighty God the Father in that Jesus the Son of God had NO BEGINNING?
Let us begin this study in God word by reading this verse in the CONTEXT of where it is found. First we will deal with the question of whether or not Jesus is saying that he is the great I AM, the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God. Then further on in this study is God's word we will address the question of whether or not Jesus is co eternal with Almighty God the great I AM.
Please read John 8:12-59 keeping in mind that Jesus and the Father are TWO different and SEPARATE individual persons or beings. Remember that the doctrine of the trinity states that Jesus is NOT the Father and the Father is NOT Jesus. But I also want you to see that only TWO are being spoken of rather than THREE. Now I realize that this is a long passage of scripture, but CONTEXT is vital if you desire the TRUTH.
15. You judge after the flesh; I judge no man.
16. And yet if I judge, my judgment is true: for I am NOT ALONE, but I AND the Father that SENT me.
17. It is also written in your law, that the testimony of TWO men is true. (Jesus plainly states that there are TWO that bear witness all the way through this entire passage of scripture, which teaches us that Jesus is NOT saying that he himself is ALMIGHTY God the great I AM, who alone is the FATHER. In other words, IF Jesus was truly saying that he himself IS the I AM, then Jesus would be saying that he is the FATHER himself.)
18. I am ONE that bear witness of myself, and the Father that SENT me bears witness of me. (in other words, Almighty God the Father is ONE witness and Jesus the SON of God is witness number TWO, which teaches us that Jesus and the Father are NOT ONE and the SAME being, but rather they are TWO separate individual persons or beings that AGREE or have the same WITNESS)
19. Then said they unto him, Where is your Father? Jesus answered, You neither know me, nor my Father: if you had known me, you should have known my Father also. (here again we see Jesus speaking of TWO separate persons)
24. I said therefore unto you, that you shall die in your sins: for if you believe NOT that I am he, you shall die in your sins. (this verse as well is used by those who teach the doctrine of the trinity to say that if you you do not believe that Jesus is saying that he is the great I AM then you shall die in your sins. The word “he” is not in the original Greek, but the UNDERSTOOD pronoun he is in the text much like the pronoun “you” is often left out of a particular sentence but the context clearly reveals to us that the subject under discussion if the UNDERSTOOD YOU. So in the same way the HE here is UNDERSTOOD. This is why the translators added the word he, because those who understand the original Greek text clearly UNDERSTAND that the pronoun “he” is clearly UNDERSTOOD)
25. Then said they unto him, WHO ARE YOU?(in other words that Jews were saying. I am he WHO. WHAT do you MEAN when you say I AM? WHO are you saying that you are when you say I AM) And Jesus said unto them, Even the SAME that I said unto you from the BEGINNING (when we go back to the BEGINNING of the ministry of Jesus we find in the Gospel of Luke that Jesus said that he was the ANOINTED ONE of Almighty God the Father that was SENT by the Father the preach the gospel of salvation).
28. Then said Jesus unto them, When you have lifted up the Son of man, then shall you know that I am he, and that I do NOTHING OF MYSELF; but as MY Father has taught me, I speak these things. (now if Jesus was one and the same being as Almighty God the I AM THAT I AM, then Jesus would be able to do anything that he desired to do, because Jesus would BE the I AM, the one true and only ALMIGHTY God. But yet the word of TRUTH clearly teaches us that Jesus could do NOTHING in and OF HIMSELF. This truth alone should prove beyond any shadow of a doubt that Jesus was NOT saying that he was the great I AM THAT I AM when he said, Before Abraham was, I am.)
29. And he that SENT me is WITH me: the Father has NOT left me ALONE; for I do always those things that please him. (again we see TWO separate persons, the Father and the SON and not just the I AM THAT I AM who alone is the FATHER.)
42. Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, you would love me: for I proceeded FORTH and came FROM God; neither came I OF MYSELF, but HE SENT me. (so again we see that Jesus is NOT identifying himself as BEING the one who sent himself. Jesus is clearly teaching us that he was sent BY the great I AM who is Almighty God.)
44. You are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father you will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
50. And I seek not mine OWN glory: there is one that seeks and judges.(here we see that Jesus does not honor himself, but rather Jesus honors his Father. So again we see two separate persons, the great I AM THAT I AM and his SON Jesus.)
54. Jesus answered, If I honor MYSELF, my honor is nothing: it is MY Father that honors me (again please notice again that Jesus is speaking of his Father, the great I AM THAT I AM as being a SEPARATE person from himself); of whom you say, that he is your God:
56. Your father Abraham rejoiced to see MY DAY: and he saw it, and was glad. (HOW did Abraham see the DAY of the Messiah, when the Messiah had NOT YET COME? I will comment on this question in a moment.)
59. Then took they up stones to cast at him: (not because Jesus was saying that he was ALMIGHTY God the Father, who alone is the great I AM THAT I AM, but rather because they did NOT believe that Jesus was the Messiah. You see the context of the previous chapters teach us that the Jew wanted to kill Jesus for breaking the Sabbath day by healing the sick on the Sabbath. The truth of the matter is that these Jewish leaders did not want to loose any of their followers to become a follower of Jesus so they picked up stones to stone him for whatever reason they could find), but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by.”
Now that you have noticed that Jesus was NOT ALONE, but rather that the Father was always WITH his Son Jesus it should become clear to you that Jesus was NOT saying that he is the great I AM THAT I AM, but rather Jesus was simply saying that BEFORE Abraham was ever born Almighty God thought to have a SON, and I am that Son of the living God. Jesus was saying that I am HE that the scriptures have prophesied should come. Jesus was saying I am the CHRIST, the ANOINTED ONE, the MESSIAH, the SON of the living God.
Remember in John 5:33-47 that Jesus said to the Jews that they search the scriptures to find eternal life, and then Jesus said the SCRIPTURE they testify of ME. Jesus was basically saying to the Jews at that time the same thing that he was the PROPHESIED one that was to come.
Here is John 5:33-47, which AGAIN clearly shows us that Almighty God was WITH his Son Jesus performing his word with SIGNS and WONDERS bearing WITNESS that Almighty God was IN his Son Jesus and that Jesus was a true man of God, who was obeying the voice of his God and Father, the great I AM THAT I AM. Jesus was NOT that he was Almighty God himself, but rather that Almighty God through his Holy Spirit DWELT IN his Son Jesus to DO the mighty works through the human hands of his Son. Jesus was saying that he was the ANOINTED ONE sent by Almighty God.
36. But I have greater witness than that of John: for the works which the Father has given me to finish, the same works that I do, bear witness of me, that the Father has sent me. (remember that Jesus also said that he could do NOTHING OF HIMSELF and that the works were done by the Father that DWELT IN him by the Holy Spirit OF Almighty God. Also remember that Almighty God the Father IS SPIRIT. In other words the Holy Spirit OF almighty God and Almighty God himself the great I AM are ONE and the SAME being. But Jesus is the SON of Almighty God the great I AM and is a SEPARATE being or person from Almighty God the Father, the great I AM THAT I AM)
39. Search the scriptures; for in them you think you have eternal life: and THEY are THEY which TESTIFY of ME. (this is HOW Abraham SAW the DAY of Jesus the COMING Messiah. Also keep in mind that the New Testament is NOT a LIVE broadcast so to speak, but rather it was written after the fact and the writer sometimes INCLUDED things that happened after the resurrection of Jesus is some of these narratives. What I mean by this is that Abraham rose from the grave WITH Jesus and this was another way that Abraham SAW the DAY of Jesus. Please read the study “WHAT AND WHERE IS PARADISE?” for a deeper understanding of how Jesus PREACHED the gospel of SALVATION to the spirits of the Old Testament saints when Jesus first descended into the lower parts of the earth for three full days and three full nights.)
43. I am come in my Father's NAME, (remember that the NAME of Jesus means Yehweh SAVES or the SALVATION of Yehweh) and you receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him you will receive (just as a side note, I believe that this verse may be prophesying the coming of Muhammad, which the seed of Abraham in the lineage of Ishmael received. Please read the study “ISLAM IS THE MARK OF THE BEAST!”).
We also read that the LAMB was slain BEFORE the foundation of the world, but in all actuality it was slain ONLY in the mind of God and his word of PROPHECY that was yet to come. So in this way Jesus was BEFORE Abraham was born.
Revelation 13:8 teaches us that in God's PLAN of salvation his Son Jesus that was NOT YET BORN was SLAIN from the FOUNDATION of the world. So far BEFORE Abraham was ever born Jesus the MESSIAH WAS.
10. If any man have an ear, let him HEAR.”
This is HOW Abraham SAW the DAY of Jesus. Also I highlight the would WAS above, because the original Greek words that are translated as I AM also mean I WAS. In other words, John 8:58 could just have easily been translated as follows:
You see the Greek words translated as “I am” are “ego eimi”, where “ego” means I, my, and me. And the Greek word “eimi”, means was, am, it is, be, exist, and have been.
These SAME Greek words are used by Jesus and OTHERS to simple say “it is I”, “I was” and “I am”. It was the TRANSLATORS who made the choice as to which phrase to use. And some translators were so BIASED that they CAPITALIZED the “I AM” to sway readers to their OWN personal INTERPRETATION of God's word. The PARAPHRASED Message Bible goes way beyond the original text to produce a very BIAS translation ADDING "who I am" to the text to say,
"Believe me," said Jesus, "I am who I am long before Abraham was anything."
But just because some translation are BIAS does NOT mean that they are CORRECT. For you see in the very next chapter we read in John 9:9 where a blind man that was healed by Jesus is asked a question if he was the one whom Jesus healed and the blind man said “EGO EIMI” or I AM. Please keep in mind the the word “he”is not in the original Greek, but rather it us UNDERSTOOD just like it is understood in John 8:24, which we will look at in a moment.
Here is John 9:1-9 where the blind man that was healed says, “EGO EIMI”or “I AM”.
Now no one would ever think that this blind man. Who was healed by Jesus, would be saying that he himself was the great I AM by simply saying “EGO EIMI” or I AM. Of course not, but yet some Christians INTERPRET these same exact Geek words “EGO EIMI” when Jesus spoke these same exact words to mean that Jesus was saying that he himself is the great I AM, as Yehweh said of himself saying, I AM that I AM in the Old Testament.
Let us go now to that Old Testament passage of scripture to see what it is actually saying. Please read Exodus 3:13-16 where we will see that the name of Almighty God is YHWH or YEHWEH in the Hebrew and transliterated by some to be Jehovah this is my name forever.
“And Moses said unto God, Behold, when I come unto the children of Israel, and shall say unto them, The God (or the Elohim or the mighty one) of your fathers has sent me unto you; and they shall say to me, What is his NAME? What shall I say unto them?
15. And God (or Elohim) said MOREOVER unto Moses (or wait Moses there is MORE that you shall say to my people when they ask WHO sent you Moses and WHAT is his NAME that sent you? ALSO), Thus shall you say unto the children of Israel, The LORD God (or YHWH, that is to say JEHOVAH the Elohim) of your fathers, the God (or the Elohim) of Abraham, the God (or the Elohim) of Isaac, and the God (or the Elohim) of Jacob, has sent me unto you: THIS IS MY NAME for ever, AND THIS IS MY MEMORIAL unto all generations. (In other words, God was saying to Moses I will BE was I will BE and my NAME is JEHOVAH forever AND my memorial is that I was and will always be the God of Abraham. The God of Isaac, and he God of Jacob.)
16. Go, and gather the elders of Israel together, and say unto them, The LORD God (or YHWH or YEHWEH or JEHOVAH the Elohim or the God) of your fathers, the God of Abraham, of Isaac, and of Jacob, appeared unto me, saying, I have surely visited you, and seen that which is done to you in Egypt:”
Please read Exodus 3:13-15 from the Complete Jerusalem Bible which gives the literal English for the Hebrew text.
15. God said FURTHER to Moshe, "Say this to the people of Isra'el: 'Yud-Heh-Vav-Heh [ADONAI], the God of your fathers, the God of Avraham, the God of Yitz'chak and the God of Ya'akov, has sent me to you.'This is my name forever; this is how I am to be remembered generation after generation.”
So then. to simple say “I am” to mean that the one speaking is saying that he is the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY GOD is going way beyond what the word of TRUTH teaches us, because God told Moses to say, I am or I will be what I am or will be and ALSO say I am or I will be and FURTHER say YHWH is my name forever.
So then, the NAME of the Elohim or the God of Israel is YHWH that is TRANSLATED as LORD in many Bibles, but none the less in the original Hebrew it is written as YHWH to be the NAME of God forever. Sometimes God's name is rendered as YEHWEH or Yud Heh Vah Heh and transliterated into English as Jehovah or Yehovah.
Now there are some Christians who strain at the gnat so to speak and dogmatically teach what they believe is the quote unquote “CORRECT” name of Almighty God as well as the “CORRECT” name of Jesus. Some of these Christians deem it blasphemy to say the name Jesus when referring to the Messiah. Anyway my point is this I have used the name of Jesus in prayer since I became a born again Spirit filled Christian at the age of 23 and God honors my prayers so someone must have fail to tell God that Jesus is not the “CORRECT”name of the Son of Almighty God the Father the great I AM. So do not be intimidate by these “ correct name” teachers.
Also as you probably noticed from the emphasis and the comments in the above verses that when we keep verse 14 in it's CONTEXT it becomes clear to us that the simple two English words “I AM” is NOT the NAME of Almighty God. Yes, Almighty God told Moses to say “I am or I will” has sent you. BUT Almighty God also told Moses to say that YHWH or JEHOVAH was his NAME.
In other words, God is saying my NAME is Jehovah and I will BE what I will be. Some have gone a little further and say that this mean that God will BE you need him to BE.
Now the LITERAL translation of these Hebrew words “Ehyeh Asher Ehyeh” is the following:
“I shall BECOME who I am BECOMING.”
"I shall BECOME who or what I am BECOMING" agrees perfectly with the rest of God's word, when you view Almighty God and his SPOKEN WORD as we read about in the New Testament in John 1:1,2,14 where in the beginning was the WORD and the WORD was WITH THE God and the WORD was God or more precisely what God was the WORD was (becoming). When God said, Light BE or Let there BE light we have no idea how LONG it took for the SPOKEN WORD of Almighty God to BECOME LIGHT. We just ASSUME that light became instantly. And this well may be the case, but my point is that God THOUGHT for light to BE and there was NO light UNTIL God SPOKE forth his THOUGHTS to become or the come into being the IMAGE of what God willed to BE when God SPOKE forth the IMAGE of his thoughts in the FORM of his WORD. And the WORD was MADE FLESH.
So then, God SPOKE forth his WORD in his word of prophecy that his Holy Spirit inspire men of old to write down of the COMING or the MESSIAH, but God HID this message here and there throughout his written word, because God had an ENEMY that was seeking to keep God's plan of salvation from coming to pass. So in the Old Testament God spoke to us through his prophets to reveal to us who he was. And then in these last days God SPOKE his WORD by the angel Gabriel to the virgin Mary and when Mary was in agreement with God's WORD she said be it done ACCORDING to your WORD and then the Holy Spirit of Almighty God moved upon Mary and the WORD was conceived in the womb of Mary and grew for nine months to come forth as a HUMAN child without a HUMAN father. The ONLY UNIQUE Son of Almighty God the Father who came to SHOW us the Father the one true and only ALMIGHTY God who alone is the great I AM THAT I AM.
In other words, Almighty God BECAME what he said he would BECOME through his SPOKEN WORD for thousands of years and then one day on a certain DAY some two thousand years ago it came to pass when the spoken WORD finally BECAME FLESH. So yes God himself did BECOME a human being. But more precisely God PREPARE a HUMAN BODY for himself to DWELL within. A HUMAN being with a WILL and mind of his own. A HUMAN BEING who could be TEMPTED in all points just like every other human being is tempted seeing that Almighty God himself CANNOT be TEMPTED. That is to say, that Jesus was a HUMAN BEING just like us except that he did NOT have a HUMAN father like us. So indeed the WORD that was the very IMAGE of God's thoughts was SPOKEN forth by Almighty God and BECAME a HUMAN BEING.
However, the WORD in whatever FORM that it WAS when the WORD was WITH God BEFORE the WORD BECAME a HUMAN BEING stripped itself of all its divinity to become FULLY HUMAN to be tempted like as we as human beings are tempted. Please read the study “A TRINITARIAN DILEMMA-PHILIPPIANS 2:6!” for a deeper understanding that WHATEVER form or nature the WORD was BEFORE the Word was MADE flesh was LAID ASIDE when the Word BECAME a HUMAN BEING, but for now let us get back to the study at hand.
Now some Christians have been taught the 'man made doctrine of the trinity for so long it is hard for them to see anything else and they argue, If Jesus was NOT saying that he was THE I AM, then WHY did the Jews pick up stones to stone him?
This is a common argument used a number of times, because there where other times as well that the Jews wanted to stone Jesus. Let us take a look at one of these other places first and then we will come back to this passage of scripture where Jesus says, Before Abraham was, I am.
Please read John 5:17,18, which is one of the most common passage of scripture used by those who teach the doctrine of the trinity to say that Jesus is EQUAL with Almighty God the Father.
18. Therefore (or for this reason) the Jews sought the more to KILL him, because he not only had broken the Sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself EQUAL with God.”
Now those that teach the doctrine of the trinity argue that the Jews knew right well hat Jesus was saying that he was EQUAL with Almighty God his Father because they wanted to KILL him. And they ALSO argue that Jesus never DENIED that he was EQUAL with Almighty God the Father.
But the TRUTH of the matter is that the Jews wanted to KILL Jesus BEFORE Jesus said that God was his Father. Please read the CONTEXT of verse 18, where you will see that the Jews wanted to KILL Jesus for supposedly breaking the Sabbath day. And you will ALSO see that Jesus did INDEED defend himself as well and was NOT making himself to be God nor equal with his God and Father the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God.
Here is John 5:15-32.
16. And therefore did the Jews persecute Jesus, and sought to SLAY him, because he had done these things ON the Sabbath day. (Here again we see the Jews wanted to KILL Jesus, but this time it was because to them Jesus broke the Sabbath day when he healed a man BY the Holy Spirit of Almighty God the Father)
17. But Jesus answered them, My Father works hitherto, and I work. (further down you will understand that this mean that the Father through his Holy Spirit was showing Jesus what to do and when to do it and Jesus simply OBEY the leading of the Holy Spirit. In simple words, Jesus was saying I am only doing what Almighty God told me to do.)
18. Therefore the JEWS sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the Sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. ( in other words, the JEWS incorrectly interpreted the words of Jesus and FALSELY ACCUSED Jesus of making himself EQUAL to Almighty God. But as you will plainly see as you continue to read the CONTEXT that Jesus ANSWERED in his DEFENSE the FOLLOWING. You see the truth of the matter is that these same Jews also FALSELY ACCUSED Jesus of being a SINNER and have a DEVIL and wanted to KILL Jesus, but we certainly do NOT believe these FALSE ACCUSATIONS)
19. Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do NOTHING OF HIMSELF, but what he sees the Father do: for what things soever he does, these also does the Son likewise. (in other words, what eer Jesus the Son of MAN saw in a dream or a vision or in the written word of God and whatever Jesus heard the Father say to do by the inward voice of the Holy Spirit, then Jesus simply OBEYED what he knew that the Father was telling him to do. Now to ME, this clearly teaches us that Jesus was in NO WAY claiming to be the great I AM nor was Jesus making himself to be EQUAL with Almighty God the Father.)
23. That all men should honor the Son, EVEN AS they honor the Father. He that honors NOT the Son honors NOT the Father which has SENT him. (in other words, the Bible teaches us that we must believe and have BOTH the Father AND the SON in order to have ETERNAL LIFE in the world to come. But yet the doctrine of the trinity wants us to believe that Jesus IS the I AM as in ONE and the SAME BEING as the I AM. Yes there is absolutely no doubt that Jesus came FROM the one true and only ALMIGHTY God. But this by no means that Jesus IS the one true and ONLY ALMIGHTY God. You see THE ALMIGHTY God has NO beginning, but Jesus the SON OF Almighty God was BEGOTTEN r brought into existence. Yes Almighty God said I SHALL BECOME who I am BECOMING, which could very well mean that Almighty God literally BECAME a HUMAN BEING. But AGAIN please read “A TRINITARIAN DILEMMA-PHILIPPIANS 2:6” where the Word laid aside all the divine advantages that he had when the Word BECAME FLESH a HUMAN BEING and dwelt among us.)
25. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. (because the God of Jesus GAVE his Son this authority)
28. Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice, (in other words, all that Jesus is and all that Jesus has INCLUDING IMMORTAL LIFE and the AUTHORITY to raise the dead was GIVEN to him BY HIS God and Father the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God who will BE what he will BE, BECAUSE Jesus was the Son of MAN and NOT because Jesus was FULLY God, nor because Jesus was the SON of God, but rather BECAUSE that Jesus was the Son of MAN a HUMAN BEING that OVERCAME the enemy by the Holy Spirit of Almighty God the DWELT IN Jesus. This is what the WHOLE word of God clearly teaches us.)
30. I can OF MY OWN SELF DO NOTHING: as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek NOT mine OWN will, BUT the will of the Father which has SENT me. (now does this sound like Jesus is saying that he himself is the great I AM or that Jesus is saying that he is EQUAL to Almighty God the Father? Absolutely NOT! Jesus himself clearly and plainly said with absolutely NO interpretation needed that he could do NOTHING in and of himself)
So here in this passage of scripture we see that it was the Jews waned to kill Jesus BEFORE these Jews, who incorrectly interpreted the words of Jesus and FALSELY ACCUSED Jesus of making himself EQUAL with Almighty God his God and Father. Then in John chapter 9 right after the Jews picked of stone to KILL him for simply saying that God was his FATHER we see Jesus healing another man on the Sabbath day and the Jews once again FALSELY ACCUSE Jesus only this time they falsely ACCUSE Jesus of being a SINNER. Please read John 9:16, where Jesus is NOW being accused of not even being a man of God and a SINNER. Wow from one extreme to the other with the FALSE ACCUSATIONS. First they accuse Jesus of making himself EQUAL with God and NOW they are accusing Jesus of not even being a man of God and a SINNER all because Jesus healed a man on the Sabbath day.
“Therefore said some of the Pharisees, This man is NOT of God, because he keeps not the Sabbath day. Others said, How can a man that is a SINNER do such miracles? And there was a DIVISION among them.”
So SOME believed that Jesus was a SINNER and others wondered HOW could a man do such mighty works if indeed he was a SINNER. So in TRUTH they did not know for sure who Jesus was, but some of the LEADERS threatened that if any Jew calls Jesus the CHRIST, then they will be thrown out of the synagogue. A little further on in John 9:30-38 we see that Jesus openly says that he IS the SON of God.
No where in scripture are we clearly and plainly taught that we MUST believe that Jesus is the I AM THAT I AM the one true and only ALMIGHTY God, but we are indeed taught CLEARLY and PLAINLY to believe that Jesus is the SON of the living God and that Jesus is the CHRIST. The disciples of Jesus understood that Jesus was a MAN who was ANOINTED with the Holy Spirit of Almighty God the Father. The disciples never called Jesus ALMIGHTY God, but rather they called Jesus the SON of God. The disciple of Jesus CLEAR saw Almighty God as being the FATHER and they called Jesus their Lord and their savior. The disciples of Jesus clearly understood that we MUST believe in BOTH the Father AND the SON in order to obtain ETERNAL LIFE in the world to come. It was ONLY the JEWS who FALSE ACCUSED Jesus of making himself EQUAL to ALMIGHTY God the Father, which the Roman Catholic church INCORRECTLY believed to be the truth when the developed the doctrine of the trinity that took HUNDREDS of year under heavy opposition.
Here is John 9:30-38 where we see the JEWS falsely accusing Jesus o being a sinner for healing a man on the Sabbath day.
Please notice that Jesus said, "Do you believe on the SON of God? " as oppose to do you believe that Jesus is the I AM THAT I AM the one true and only ALMIGHTY God?
Now some of you who are reading this study in God's word may have been cast out of a church for NOT believing the false doctrines that they teach. If this is you, be of good cheer for Jesus knows that you have held fast to his word of TRUTH.
And Jesus knows also those of you who are truly seeking to know the truth and I assure you that as you CONTINUE n God's word you will come to know the TRUTH and the truth will make you free. The MORE that you see the TRUTH that Jesus was a MAN who was ANOINTED with the Holy Spirit of his God and Father, then the more you will walk in the steps of Jesus knowing that since Jesus, as a MAN, overcame sin BY or THROUGH the Holy Spirit of his God and Father and that this SAME Holy Spirit now DWELLS IN YOU, then this will increase your FAITH to do the SAME works that Jesus did.
This is the main reason of why I write so many studies exposing the ERRORS of INTERPRETATION of the scriptures that ave conclude Jesus to be FULLY ALMIGHTY God in the flesh, because this false teaching misleads Christian to FALSELY conclude the ONLY Jesus can heal the sick and live without sin. I also teach what I teach because I am thoroughly convinced that NO doctrine of the church that DRIVES people AWAY from God can possibly be a TRUE teaching of god's word of TRUTH. Now you may have never realized this before, but there are Christians turning to ISLAM, because Muslims are EXPOSING some of these SAME ERRORS that I am exposing. Also I have personally heard people say that they word believe in God IF it were NOT for the doctrine of three in one and one in three.
With that being said let us go back to the verse in question and read where the Jews picked up stones to kill Jesus, which some INTERPRET as meaning that Jesus was saying that he himself IS the great I AM THAT I AM.
Now there is absolutely nothing it the CONTEXT to lead anyone to draw the conclusion that the REASON that the Jews wanted to stone Jesus was because Jesus was saying that he himself was the ALMIGHTY God just because Jesus said “EGO EIMI” which the translators chose to translate as “I am” and other translators chose to translate as “I AM”. The context simple says that they took up stones to cast at him.
The TRUTH of the matter is that some of these Jews who were leaders did NOT want any of their followers to follow this man for fear that they would leave off following them. I truth some of these Jews want to kill Jesus because he broke the Sabbath day by healing the sick on the Sabbath day. Other Jews did not want anyone to say the Jesus was the CHRIST.
Now to ME, this truth the ENEMY definitely wants to keep from Christians, because he knows that when believers truly get a hold on this truth that the works done in the early church will be nothing in comparison to the later day rain of God's Holy Spirit. I am convince that once Christians truly begin to see the HUMANITY of Jesus and the truth that the Holy Spirit of Almighty God DWELT IN Jesus to EMPOWER Jesus to do the works that he did, then more and more Christians will begin to FOLLOW in the steps of Jesus and DO the very same works of healing that Jesus did though the holy Spirit that dwelt in him.
This brings us to section 2 or part 2,where we will take a look at the second question of whether or not Jesus was CO ETERNAL with the Father as the doctrine of the trinity also teaches.
SECTION # 2
In this section we will address the question of whether or not Jesus is CO ETERNAL with the Father. In other words, “Does Jesus saying the words “I AM” mean that Jesus preexisted for all eternity like Almighty God? In other words, was Jesus as the SON of Almighty God ALWAYS in existence WITH Almighty God the Father in that Jesus the Son of God had NO BEGINNING?
Let us begin this section by reading John 8:47-58.
So then, it we use the meaning of “EGO EIMI” to be translated as “I WAS”, or I HAVE BEEN. or I EXISTED, then does this prove that Jesus was CO ETERNAL with the Father?
There are two schools of thought about exactly HOW Jesus preexisted with Almighty God in the beginning.
On school of thought is that Jesus existed with Almighty God in the beginning as a literal second person possessing a form, a voice and a will. Now this school is divided, in that some say that this SPIRIT being was Jesus as the SON of Almighty God that was by his Fathers side BEFORE the creation of the world. Other say NO this cannot be so. And they say that Jesus existed as the WORD that was a SPIRIT being as well, but was NOT YET the SON of Almighty God.
The second school of thought is that Jesus existed as the WORD of God, as being the LITERAL WORD of Almighty God in his THOUGHTS. In other words, whatever Almighty God THOUGHT and then brought forth his THOUGH in the FORM or the IMAGE of what he was thinking to become and then SPOKE forth his very own thought, then the WORD or the IMAGE of what God was thinking came into being.
Now to ME, this is the ONLY way that I myself can rationalize the WORD being ONE and the SAME BEING as Almighty God, because the WORD of God would actually BE God's very own BEING.
As far as the first school of thought, to ME I see TWO separate beings ALWAYS existing.
However this does NOT AGREE with the WHOLE word f Almighty God, because CLEARLY ONE, speaking of the SON of God was BEGOTTEN or had a BEGINNING. There is simply NO WAY around this. Listen to one on the writers from the early church who persecutes Arius for being a HERETIC and casts him out of the church.
Arius writes a letter to Eusebius about the persecution that he and his fellow brothers and sisters in the Lord are receiving from the bishop Alexander of the church of Alexandria, Egypt:
“1.) To that most beloved man of God, the faithful and orthodox Eusebius, from Arius, unjustly persecuted by father Alexander because of the all-conquering truth which you, Eusebius, also are defending!
(2.) Since my father Ammonius is going to Nicomedia, it seemed reasonable and proper to greet you through him, remembering at the same time the innate love and affection which you have for the brothers on account of God and his Christ, because the bishop [Alexander] is severely ravaging and persecuting us and moving against us with every evil. Thus he drives us out of every city like godless men, since we will not AGREE with HIS public statements: that there was “always a God, ALWAYS a Son;” “as soon as the Father, so soon the Son [existed];” “with the Father co-exists the Son unbegotten, ever-begotten, begotten without begetting;” “God neither PRECEDES the Son in aspect or in a moment of time;” “always a God, ALWAYS a Son, the Son being from God himself.”
Now to ME, this DOGMATIC demand of the Roman Catholic church to ENFORCE this doctrine of of the trinity that demands that there be a CO ETERNAL SON, who had absolutely NO BEGINNING simple does NOT AGREE with what the WHOLE word of Almighty God clearly teaches us. And this is what Arius was trying to get the Roman Catholic church to see. In some of the writings about Arius he is praise highly for his godly moral life, but at the same time he and the MANY who believed what he taught were heavily persecuted by bishop Alexander of Alexandria.
And when you take a close look at what this Catholic bishop Alexander taught I myself half to wonder who the real heretic is. I mean what kind of SOUND BIBLICAL statement is:
”There was “always a God, ALWAYS a Son;” “as soon as the Father, so soon the Son [existed];” “with the Father co-exists the Son unbegotten, ever-begotten, begotten without begetting;” “God neither PRECEDES the Son in aspect or in a moment of time;” “always a God, ALWAYS a Son, the Son being from God himself.”
I mean really that would truly be a MYSTERY for the Son to be UNBEGOTTEN, EVER BEGOTTEN, and to be begotten WITHOUT being BEGOTTEN.
As for ME, if words mean anything at all, then Jesus did indeed have a BEGINNING. That is to say, the word of TRUTH clearly teaches us that Almighty God is NOT begotten and is self existing from eternity past to eternity future. But as fro the SON OF Almighty God he was indeed BEGOTTEN. So then Almighty God is NOT begotten and has always existed of his OWN being, but yet the SON was BEGOTTEN OF Almighty God on a certain DAY. The scripture says, THIS DAY have I BEGOTTEN you. Please read Hebrews 1:1-9, which clearly teaches us that there was a CERTAIN DAY on which the SON of Almighty God came into existence where he had never existed before except in the mind and plan of Almighty God as God's WORD spoken forth by the prophets of old.
“God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,
2. Has in these last days spoken unto us by his SON (you see, up to the time that Jesus was brought forth into being God spoke in the OLD Testament to his people BY his PROPHETS. We do not find anywhere in CLEAR, PLAIN words that Jesus or the SON of God spoke to anyone in the OLD Testament, but in the NEW Testament Almighty God chose to speak to us by his only BEGOTTEN SON.), whom he has appointed heir of all things, BY (in truth the original Greek word also mean FOR THE SAKE OF) whom also he (Almighty God through his SPOKEN WORD) made the worlds;
3. Who being the brightness of his glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
4. Being made so much better than the angels, as he has BY inheritance OBTAINED a more excellent name than they.
5. For unto which of the angels said he at any time, You are my SON, THIS DAY have I BEGOTTEN you? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a SON (please keep in mind that the writer of Hebrews is quoting and Old Testament PROPHECY of the COMING of the only BEGOTTEN SON OF Almighty God that at the time it was written it was yet a FUTURE DAY that the SON would be BEGOTTEN of Almighty God and then ON THAT CERTAIN DAY Almighty God BECAME a Father)?
6. And again, when he brings in the FIRST begotten into the world, he said, And let all the angels of God worship him.(in other words, AGAIN speaking of the SECOND coming of Jesus when God bring his Son Jesus back into the world to rule and reign for 1000 years in his Father's kingdom even the angels will worship his SON as God, because Jesus will be the God of this world. Satan who is presently the god of this world will be bound for the 1000 years while Jesus reigns as God.)
9. You have loved righteousness, and hated iniquity; therefore (or because you have loved righteousness and have OVERCOME the enemy) God, EVEN YOUR God, has ANOINTED you with the oil of gladness above your fellows (that is to say Almighty God HIGHLY EXALTED his SON Jesus above everyone but himself being a God OVER his SON).”
Now most certainly every Christian would agree without a doubt that the HUMAN Jesus was BORN of a woman the virgin Mary and therefore came into EXISTENCE as a HUMAN being where the HUMAN Jesus did NOT ever exist before, UNTIL he was BORN by the spoken WORD of Almighty God and then he was GIVEN the name Jesus, which means the SALVATION of YHWH or YEHWEH or Jehovah or Almighty God the great I shall BECOME who or what I am BECOMING.
And also most every Christian would also AGREE that Jesus was the FIRST born from the dead to be GIVEN ETERNAL LIFE so as to never die again. You see Jesus was NOT IMMORTAL until Almighty God raised his SON from the dead and GAVE his SON LIFE EVEN AS Almighty God the Father has always had IMMORTAL LIFE in himself. Please read John 5:18-30, which CLEARLY and PLAINLY teaches us that Jesus was NOT always an IMMORTAL being who preexisted with Almighty God for all eternity past. In other words, this passage of scripture clearly exposes the ERROR of the FALSE doctrine of the trinity that states that Jesus the Son of Almighty God is CO ETERNAL with the Father.
“Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the Sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. (again this is just a FALSE ACCUSATION by the Jew falsely accusing Jesus of making himself equal to his God and Father the one true and only ALMIGHTY God who alone is the I AM)
19. Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The SON can DO NOTHING OF HIMSELF, but what he sees the Father do: for what things soever he does, these also does the Son likewise. (in other words, as Jesus see the Father heal people in a vision of a dream Jesus simply obeys what he see and by faith does what he sees his Father do. Also as Jesus hears the voice of the Holy Spirit of his Father speaking to him Jesus simply OBEYS his Father and the Father does the WORK. Jesus is saying the Holy Spirit of my God and Father that DWELLS IN me HE does the works that you see me do, because I myself can do NOTHING in and of myself. So there is absolutely no way that Jesus was saying that he himself is Almighty God the great I AM at any time not matter how some INTERPRET these words of Jesus to mean.)
20. For the Father loves the Son, and shows him all things that himself does: and he will shew him greater works than these, that you may marvel.
21. For as the Father raises up the dead, and quickens them; even so the Son quickens whom he will.
22. For the Father judges no man, but has COMMITTED ALL judgment unto the SON:
23. That all men should honor the Son, EVEN AS they honor the Father. He that honors NOT the Son honors NOT the Father which has SENT him. (The Bible clearly teaches us that we must have BOTH the Father AND the SON in order to obtain ETERNAL LIFE in the world to come)
24. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that hears my word, and believes on him that SENT me, has everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.
25. Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. (because Almighty God has GIVEN and COMMITTED this authority into the hands of his SON Jesus)
26. For AS the Father has life IN himself (speaking of IMMORTAL LIFE); so has he GIVEN to the Son to have life in himself;
27. And has GIVEN him authority to execute judgment also, BECAUSE he is the Son of MAN. (you see every thing that Jesus is or has was GIVEN to him BY hid God and Father who ALONE is the great I AM)
28. Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29. And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
30. I can of mine OWN SELF DO NOTHING: (so ask your self the question, HOW can the great I AM THAT I AM the one true and only ALMIGHTY God do NOTHING, if so be that Jesus was truly saying that he himself was THE I AM when Jesus said Before Abraham was, I am? The truth of the matter Jesus was saying, Before Abraham was, I WAS, as in the SON was in the mind and plan of Almighty God BEFORE Abraham was born and Abraham SAW the truth of the COMING Messiah that would be ANOINTED BY his God and Father the great I AM THAT I AM or I shall BECOME who or what I am BECOMING through my SPOKEN WORD) as I hear, I judge: and my judgment is just; because I seek not mine OWN will, but the will of the Father which has SENT me.”
Now some Christians even in spite of all the CLEAR PLAIN and SIMPLE evidence of God's word of TRUTH showing us that Jesus was BEGOTTEN of Almighty God, but yet Almighty God was NOT begotten by any one because Almighty God ALONE has always been IMMORTAL. Please read 1 Timothy 6:14-16, where we CLEARLY see that the ONLY POTENTATE who is the SOVEREIGN ALMIGHTY God was the ONLY one ALONE always had IMMORTALITY until he GAVE this same eternal life to his SON Jesus AFTER he raised his Son from the dead.
That you keep this commandment without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
15. Which in his times (speaking of the first and second coming of Jesus) he (Jesus) shall SHOW, WHO is the blessed and ONLY Potentate, the King of kings , and Lord of lords; (you see there can be ONLY ONE who is ALMIGHTY God who is THE MOST HIGH God OVER all over gods that where MADE to BE gods BY the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God)
16. Who ONLY has IMMORTALITY, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom NO man has seen, NOR CAN see (because Almighty God is SPIRIT and he is INVISIBLE): to whom be honor and power everlasting. Amen.”
Remember the the SON came into being on a certain day and when the Son became obedient unto death then and only then did the God and Father OF the SON GIVE his SON as his reward IMMORTALITY. This is what the WHOLE word of God clearly teaches us.
But yet some Christians in spite of all this evidence still seem to have problems or the disagreements, when they try to INTERPRET verses like the following this study below, because they have been TAUGHT to believe these verse to mean only ONE thing. But the TRUTH of the matter is that there is MORE than just ONE interpretation for the verses that follow that are used to TRY and prove the man made doctrine of the trinity:
Thanks for reading. May God bless you richly as you continue to seek the TRUTH of the WHOLE word of Almighty God. Below are some other verses that are used to try and support the doctrine of the trinity and the deity of Jesus. There may be other verses which you may be having trouble seeing any other way that what you were dogmatically taught, but I assure you that each and every verse used by those who teach the doctrine of the trinity does indeed have a different meaning that does NOT CONTRADICT any other part of God's word.
Your brother in our Lord Jesus Christ,
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Verses used to try and support the doctrine of the trinity.
Thanks for reading. May God bless you richly as you continue to seek the TRUTH of the WHOLE word of Almighty God.
Your brother in our Lord Jesus the CHRIST.
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