IS THE TRINITY FOUND IN CREATION?
A brother in the Lord wrote to me after reading some of the studies I wrote asking me if I had a TENETS of faith saying that he liked and agreed with what he has read thus far, but before he could recommend AMatterOfTruth.com to any one he needed to know what I believed and taught.
This is perfectly understandable for I myself am reluctant to recommend some websites to my readers seeing that I do not find that all they teach is sound Biblical teaching based upon the whole word of God. And when I do recommend another website I try always to point out that I do not necessarily agree will ALL that this other website teaches.
Now at that time I hand not yet posted any TENETS of faith, but I did have an INCOMPLETE tenets of faith in my notes on my computer that I had started, but had not yet finished, so I sent him what I had written thus far and briefly explained much of the rest that I believed without the scripture references. I sent him my TENETS of faith simply because he REQUESTED it of me even though I had not finished them. I told him that he was the FIRST to read what I had written thus far as my TENETS of faith and I added that I did NOT believe in the doctrine of the trinity NOR did I believe in the doctrine of Oneness of modalism knowing deep down inside of me that this is what he truly wanted to know.
It was then that he wrote back telling me that he could not refer AMatterOfTruth.com to any one until I had a COMPLETE list of TENETS of faith. He then went on to say, that he agreed with everything I taught EXCEPT where he DIFFERED with my position about the doctrine of the TRINITY and he sent me the following article to support why he himself believed in the trinity, which I will place in BLUE type so that my readers can easily see what I myself teach to what some in the main stream church are teaching.
All my comments and teaching will be in black type, which will be ADDED within the article sent to me in order to make this study as short as possible, but yet clearly show the errors of this article. For further in depth studies I will refer to the studies that I have already written.
Now before we begin this study in God's word I would like to point out that on the SURFACE reading of the Bible there SEEMS to be three persons or beings who work together in unity and in agreement as one. However, in digging deeper into God's word one can clearly see that God is not three person in one God. And most definitely everyone should be able to clearly see that Jesus is NOT EQUAL in every way with Almighty God the Father, nor is Jesus CO ETERNAL with Almighty God having always existed as Son of God without a beginning. All of this will be explained in great detail in this study and the studies that I refer you to read if so be you are truly seeking to know the TRUTH of the WHOLE word of God.
Let us now begin this study in God's word by reading the introduction of the following trinitarian article. Also all EMPHASIS is mine
Understanding The Trinity from God’s fingerprints on His Universe
The Trinity is a difficult concept to understand. Some think it is a logical contradiction. Others call it a mystery. Does the Bible teach it? Yes it does, but that doesn't automatically make it easier to comprehend.
The Trinity is defined as one God who exists in three ETERNAL, simultaneous, and distinct persons known as The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit. Such a definition may suffice for some, but for others this explanation is insufficient.
Please notice that this article begins by saying that the doctrine of the trinity is DIFFICULT to understand. Yes it is and very confusing to some who have even left the church because of this one man made doctrine. And yes indeed I do agree that for some this explanation is insufficient. You see, for some like myself and MANY other God fearing faithful believers in Jesus as the Son of God, who died for our sins we simply cannot accept the false teaching that Jesus has ALWAYS been an ETERNAL being who has always preexisted WITH Almighty God from all eternity past WITHOUT beginning as Almighty God. The Bible itself does NOT teach that Jesus, the SON OF God, has always preexisted WITHOUT ever having a BEGINNING. Please read the study “DID JESUS PREEXIST AS THE SON OF GOD?”.
But rather the word of truth makes it perfectly clear in simplicity without any need for any INTERPRETATION that Almighty God the Father ALONE is the ONLY being who has ALWAYS been IMMORTAL having life IN HIMSELF, which he then GAVE to his SON Jesus AFTER Jesus became obedient to die on the cross for the sins on mankind.
Please read 1 Timothy 6:13-16 where we are plainly taught that the ALMIGHTY God the Father is the ONLY POTENTATE who ONLY has always been IMMORTAL.
“I give YOU charge in the sight of God, who quickens (or who makes ALIVE or give LIFE to) all things, AND before Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed a good confession; (Please notice that there are TWO distinct person to who we are being given CHARGE in the sight of. The first person of being is Almighty God the Father and the second person is the SON OF God, Jesus the Christ or the ANOINTED one Jesus. Now WHAT are we giving CHARGE to DO?)
14. That (you) KEEP this commandment (In other words, Timothy is giving us CHARGE to KEEP the following TEACHING) without spot, unrebukeable, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ:
15. Which in his times (Speaking of both the first and second comings of Jesus) he (again referring to Jesus) shall show, (Jesus came to SHOW us the FATHER) WHO is the blessed and ONLY Potentate (the word POTENTATE means the ONLY ONE who is the ALMIGHTY who is over ALL others. Therefore ANY one who is UNDER or subordinate to THE ONLY one who ONLY is the ALMIGHTY cannot possible BE the ALMIGHTY. And Jesus the SON OF Almighty God is clearly shown to us in the word of truth as being SUBJECT to HIS God and FATHER, who ALONE is THE ALMIGHTY and ONLY POTENTATE), the King of kings, and Lord of lords;
16. Who ONLY has IMMORTALITY, dwelling in the light which no man can approach unto; whom no man has SEEN, NOR CAN SEE: to whom be honor and power everlasting. Amen.”
People have SEEN Jesus and most Christian KNOW without a doubt that Jesus is NOT the FATHER who is INVISIBLE and CANNOT be SEEN by any mortal man. This is WHY God sent his SON Jesus to SHOW us the FATHER at his first coming and will yet show us further at his second coming. Scripture is very clear that Jesus did NOT come to show us HIMSELF. Jesus always pointed us to the FATHER giving all the glory to his God and Father as being the one who DWELT IN him who was the one doing the WORKS that men saw Jesus doing.
So it is the FATHER who ONLY is the ALMIGHTY and who ONLY has always been IMMORTAL according to the word of TRUTH, the Holy Bible and this SOUND BIBLICAL TRUTH contradicts the man made doctrine of the trinity which falsely states that Jesus is CO ETERNAL with Almighty God the FATHER.
Also please read John 5:26,27 where we are clearly and plainly taught in simplicity without any need of any INTERPRETATION that Jesus the SON OF Almighty God was GIVEN immortality, eternal life or LIFE to have in himself EVEN AS the Father HAS always had life IN HIMSELF by his god and FATHER, who alone is THE ALMIGHTY the ONE TRUE God.
“For AS the Father HAS life in himself; so has he GIVEN to the Son to have life in himself;
27. AND has GIVEN him authority to execute judgment ALSO, BECAUSE he is the Son of MAN.”
Please notice two things in the passage of scripture. The first thing that I want you to see directly from the WORD of Almighty God himself is that Jesus was GIVEN the very same IMMORTALITY who ONLY Almighty God the FATHER has always possessed IN HIMSELF, And the second thing that I want you to see is that the very REASON of WHY Jesus was ALSO GIVEN the power and the authority to judge mankind and the fallen angels is BECAUSE Jesus was the Son of MAN. NOT because Jesus was Almighty God himself. And NOT because Jesus was the SON OF Almighty God. But rather BECAUSE Jesus was the Son of MAN being FULLY a HUMAN BEING like as we are without having any advantage over any other human being. Please read the study “PHILIPPIANS 2:6---A TRINITARIAN DILEMMA !” for a deeper understand of why it is so important to see and understand the HUMANITY of Jesus who was ANOINTED or ENDUED with power from on high the SAME as all believers in Jesus who have received the fullness of the Holy Spirit.
I pray that all my readers and seekers of the TRUTH of the WHOLE word of God will see WHY I no longer can believe or teach the man made DOCTRINE of the trinity which CONTRADICTS what the Bible itself teaches us in SIMPLICITY that is NOT HARD to understand like the man made DOCTRINE of the trinity.
Let us move on with the rest of this trinitarian article that was sent to me in order to show those who are truly seeking the truth the many other errors made in interpreting the scriptures.
Therefore, to help understand the Trinity better, I offer the following analogy that, I THINK, is hinted to in Rom. 1:20:
"For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made."
Please understand that the following is the personal INTERPRETATION of what the writer of this article THINKS that Paul meant by this verse and it is NOT the clear, plain and simple word of God that does NOT need any INTERPRETATION to be understood. In other words, the above verse can have several different interpretations, but always remember that whatever interpretation that one concludes a certain verse to mean, then that interpretation must AGREE will ALL of God's word.
As I have said many times that any verse when viewed ALONE and APART from the rest of God's word may SEEM or may made to seem to be saying something that it is not truly saying in the light of the whole word of God. With that being said let us continue to closely examine this article on the trinity.
Should we be able to learn about God's attributes, power, and nature by looking at what He has made? Apparently, according to the Bible, this is possible.
When a painter paints a picture, what is in him is reflected in the painting he produces. When a sculptor creates a work of art, it is from his heart and mind that the source of the sculpture is born. The work is shaped by his creative ability. The creators of art leave their marks on their work, something that is their own, something that reflects what they are. Did God do the same thing? Did God leave His fingerprints on His creation? Of course He did. Creation, The universe consists of three elements: Time, Space, and Matter. Each of these is comprised of three 'components.
Now one could just as easily have POINTED out the patterns of TWO being in God's creation, or the patterns of FOUR or FIVE, or eight, but because a CERTAIN agenda is desired this trinitarian author chose the number THREE in order to try and prove the man made doctrine of the trinity meaning three.
As the Trinitarian doctrine maintains, each of the persons of the Godhead is distinct, yet they are all each, by nature, God.
In truth the GODHEAD in the word of God always speaks of the FATHER ONLY as being THE Godhead. It is only the man made doctrine of the trinity that defines the Godhead as being composed of THREE distinct co eternal and co equal divine beings making up the GODHEAD.
Please read in the Bible itself where we again are taught in SIMPLICITY that the Godhead DWELT IN Jesus, rather than Jesus being a PART OF the Godhead as God the Son, the second person of the so called trinitarian Godhead of three Gods making up the one true God. Here is Colossians 2:8,9 where we can clearly see the Godhead DWELLING IN the SON OF Almighty God the GODHEAD.
“Beware lest (or beware for fear that) any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ (or NOT after Jesus being the ANOINTED one OF Almighty God where the ANOINTING was IN Jesus).
9. For (or because we clearly have seen that) IN him (or IN Jesus the SON OF God, IN) him DWELLS all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.”
In other words, IN the BODY of FLESH of Jesus, the SON OF Almighty God the Father DWELT the FATHER the FULLNESS of the GODHEAD. We know from other parts of God's word that the ANOINTING dwelling IN Jesus was the FATHER the ETERNAL SPIRIT who was the one doing the works that men saw Jesus doing. The word FULLNESS means ALL of the Godhead DWELT IN Jesus. So then clearly seeing that ALL the Godhead DWELT IN Jesus it is not possible for Jesus to be the so called SECOND person OF the Godhead.
Also I would like to point out that the phrase “after the RUDIMENTS of the world” is LITERALLY translated as “after the ELEMENTS of the world”.
To me, it is like the writer of Colossians knew that some Christians would try and use the elements of creation like TIME, SPACE, and MATTER to SPOIL other Christians through PHILOSOPHY or through one's own personal INTERPRETATION and VAIN DECEIT or false teaching that is VAIN or useless and really does not ADD to one's faith to empower them to over come the enemy, and after TRADITION of men, which is exactly what the doctrine of the trinity is, the TRADITION of MEN, where men literally took CENTURIES to form this man made doctrine and ultimately INTIMIDATE or even force believers to accept it as the truth or be martyred for denying the doctrine of the trinity.
Please notice the ELEMENTS of the world or creation being used in this article to VAINLY deceive many Christians that blinds some believers to the truth that the SAME eternal Spirit who empower his SON Jesus to over come sin NOW DWELLS IN us to EMPOWER us to over come sin. It saddens me to hear Christians parroting what they are being taught that they CANNOT live without sin and ONLY Jesus was able to live without sin because they are falsely taught Jesus was Almighty God himself who could NOT be tempted and thus could NOT sin so the blindly believe the LIE of the enemy and continue to sin wrongly believing that sin is just a part of being a Christian, because they were wrongly taught that ONLY Jesus can live without sin.
With Time; for example, the past is distinct from the present, which is distinct from the future. Each is simultaneous. Yet, they are not three 'times,' but one. That is, they all share the same nature: time
With Space; height is distinct
from width, which is distinct from depth, which is distinct from
height. Yet, they are not three 'spaces,' but one. That is, they all
share the same nature: space.
With Matter; solid is not the same as liquid, which is not the same as gas, which is not the same as solid. Yet, they are not three 'matters,' but one. That is, they all share the same nature: matter.
Note that there are three sets of threes. In other words, there is a trinity of trinities. As we look at the universe and notice these qualities within it, is it fair to say that these are the fingerprints of God upon His creation? I think so. Not only is this simply an observation, but it is also a good source for an analogy of the Trinity. As we look at the the simplicity of each part. it is easy to understand the magnitude of the whole.
Now while I agree that these elements of creation are distinct from each other I do NOT agree that this analogy proves that God himself is a trinity with three distinct persons making up the one true God. As I said early one could have just as easily picked the patterns of TWO being in creation to try and prove that the Bible teaches only TWO rather than three. God made us to have TWO eyes to see, We have TWO ears to hear. God mad day differ from night, light from darkness. The earth is divided into TWO hemispheres. We have a north pole and a south pole. God made man and God made woman. God set before us life or death. And the list goes on and on as one dwells on the patterns of TWO in creation. So the ME the analogy of three being found in creation does not prove that God is a trinity.
Strictly from The Bible
As it should always be. I am a firm believer that we should base the teachings of the church on Scripture first and only use church history if it agrees with the whole word of God. Again we must always base what we teach upon ALL of God's word, and NOT just upon PART of God's word. Sound Biblical teaching uses the WHOLE word of God as opposed to taking verses OUT of CONTEXT and NOT considering the conclusion that is drawn in the LIGHT of the rest of God's word. In other words, I will show my readers and seekers of the truth of the WHOLE word of God that the following verses cited in this trinitarian article do NOT take into consideration the WHOLE word of God.
The members of the Trinity are distinguished one from another in various passages: In the Old Testament, "LORD" is distinguished from "Lord" (Genesis 19:24; Hosea 1:4).
I AGREE that LORD refers to Almighty God Yahweh and Lord refers to a lord under the supreme LORD Yahweh. But what I do not agree with is that God is a trinity.
The "LORD" has a "Son" (Psalm 2:7, 12; Proverbs 30:2-4).
Spirit is distinguished from the "LORD" (Numbers 27:18) and from "God"(Psalm 51:10-12).
Please read the in depth study “THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE FATHER !” for all the verses that prove that there is just ONE ETERNAL SPIRIT, who IS Almighty God the FATHER. I do agree that SOME verses may SEEM like the Holy Spirit COULD be seen as a separate person sent by God, but in the LIGHT of the WHOLE word of God the Holy Spirit is clearly seen as being the ONE Eternal Spirit who alone is Almighty God the SOURCE of all that is.
God the Son is distinguished from God the Father (Psalm 45:6-7; Hebrews 1:8-9).
In the New Testament, John 14:16-17 is where Jesus speaks to the Father about sending a Helper, the Holy Spirit. This shows that Jesus did not consider Himself to be the Father or the Holy Spirit.
Consider also all of the other times in the Gospels where Jesus speaks to the Father. Was He speaking to Himself? No. He spoke to another person in the Trinity; The Father.
I AGREE that Jesus was speaking to his God and Father, the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God, who is most definitely another being apart from Jesus. In other words, I agree that Jesus is NOT the FATHER. But I do NOT agree that God is a TRINITY or that Jesus was speaking to another person of a so called trinity. Personally I believe that the WHOLE word of God teaches us that there are only TWO and NOT three. Again please read the in depth study “THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE FATHER !” along with all the related studies explaining the errors of the doctrine of the trinity and the doctrine of oneness or modalism.
Each member of the Trinity is God: The Father is God: John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2.
I AGREE in that Almighty God the Father is THE ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God who is over ALL including his SON Jesus. But again I do NOT agree that God is a so called trinity.
The Son is God: John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20.
I AGREE that Jesus is called God by his God and Father in Hebrews 1:8, but actually the only verse where we are clearly and plainly taught that Jesus is God is Hebrews 1:8 where we are ALSO clearly taught in the very next verse that the Father is THE GOD OVER his SON Jesus who has actually only become a God AFTER the cross when his God HIGHLY EXALTED his SON because of his OBEDIENCE to die on the cross. More on this later.
For now I want to just briefly point out the error in INTERPRETATION in the other verses cited here as so called proof text to try and prove that Jesus is God, and not only that Jesus is “A” God under and subject to his God, but rather that Jesus is the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God HIMSELF being FULLY ALMIGHTY God and fully a human being at the SAME time.
Just briefly John 1:1 does NOT say that Jesus was WITH God, and Jesus was God, but rather that word of truth simply states that the WORD, the LOGOS, or the SAYING was WITH THE God and the saying or the spoken word was God. So then it is the INTERPRETATION of some that MAKE this verse say what THEY WANT it to say. Please read the in depth study called “JOHN 1:1 THE WORD WAS GOD !”, which will clearly show you that the WHOLE word of God teaches us that Almighty God HIMSELF literally BECAME a human Being leaving behind or laying aside ALL of his DIVINE NATURE to BECOME FULLY a HUMAN BEING like as we are who would be called the SON of the highest. And then Almighty in the fullness of time would ANOINT or come and DWELL IN the body of FLESH of Jesus to EMPOWER his SON to over come sin and do the works that Almighty God sent his SON out into the world to do after his baptism by John.
Romans 9:5 is simply a translators error misleading some to INTERPRET this verse a Jesus being God. First let us read this verse from the King James translation.
“Whose are the fathers, and of whom as concerning the flesh Christ came, who is over all, God blessed for ever. Amen.”
Now in SIMPLICITY like many other verses the apostles always gave the glory and honor to Almighty God the FATHER and this verse is doing the very same thing saying blessed be GOD forever Amen is referring to blessing being given to Almighty God the Father for preforming his word to bring it to pass.
The subject under discussion is God's chosen people the Israelites OUT OF whom according to the FLESH came forth Jesus the MESSIAH which is exactly what was PROPHESIED in the Old Testament that God would raise up FROM AMONG the PEOPLE of Israel their CHRIST.
Here is the LITERAL translation.
“Of whom the fathers (speaking of the fathers of Israel) and OUT of whom the ANOINTED the according to flesh (or according to the flesh. In other words, OUT of the LINAGE or seed of the tribes of Israel, who are the fathers came the CHRIST, the ANOINTED one of God) the one being over all God blessed into the eons Amen.”
Now one can INTERPRET this verse several ways, but again whatever the INTERPRETATION that conclusion which is drawn or interpreted it MUST AGREE with ALL the rest of God's word. You have already heard the INTERPRETATION making the claim that this verse is saying that Jesus is THE ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God because of the phrase the one being "OVER ALL God blessed forever, Amen."
And you have heard my INTERPRETATION that Jesus was ANOINTED by God FULFILLING his promise to raise up the CHRIST from among the people and Paul is simply giving thanks and blessing to Almighty God the Father for raising up a savior to save the people from their sins.
Now if so be that one interprets the phrase "the ONE BEING OVER all" as indeed referring to Jesus himself as opposed to referring to the ANOINTING who DWELT IN Jesus speaking of the ANOINTING as being the FATHER, the fullness of the Godhead who DWELT IN his SON Jesus, then this still does NOT prove that Jesus IS ALMIGHTY God HIMSELF, because other parts of God's word clearly teach us that Almighty God the Father GAVE his SON Jesus all power and authority to be over all TO the GLORY of the Father.
The next verse found in Colossians 2:9 we have already taken a look at which clearly shows us that the GODHEAD was DWELLING IN Jesus rather than Jesus being the second person of the Godhead.
Now let us take a closer look at 1 John 5:20 by first reading it from the King James Version.
“And we know that the SON OF God is come, and has given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true (who did Jesus come to SHOW us and give us an UNDERSTANDING? Jesus came to SHOW us the FATHER), and we are in him (speaking of being IN the FATHER) that is true, even (the word EVEN here is NOT in the original Greek text and thus this ADDED word can lead some to MISINTERPRET this verse as Jesus being the one who is the TRUE God. But in truth this verse is actually saying that we a IN the FATHER who is TRUE when we are) in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.”
Let us now read the LITERAL translation of this verse in 1 John 5:20.
“We have perceived that the SON OF THE God is arriving (or has come) and has given us comprehension that we may be knowing the true one and we are IN the true one IN the SON OF HIM Jesus anointed (or we are IN the true one by being IN the SON OF HIM ANOINTED by Almighty God the Father) this one (speaking of the FATHER) is the TRUE God and eternal life (is being IN the SON for whosoever has the SON has the Father also.)
The phrase "we are IN the TRUE ONE IN the SON OF HIM" clearly identifies Almighty God the Father as the TRUE ONE. Can you not see that Jesus is the Son OF HIM who is the true one where HIM, the true one, is the one is the FATHER OF the SON. And we are IN the Father whenever we are IN the SON. Now when we COMPARE like scripture with this scripture that is in question we can confirm the above interpretation as being the truth of the whole word of God. Please read the words or Jesus found in John 17:2,3 where Jesus is praying to his god and Father the ONLY TRUE and ALMIGHTY God.
“As YOU (Father) have GIVEN him (the SON) power over all flesh, that he (the SON) should give eternal life to as many as YOU (Father) have GIVEN him.
3. And THIS is life eternal, THAT they might know YOU (Father) the ONLY TRUE God, AND (that they may also know your SON) Jesus Christ, whom YOU have sent.”
When we compare this clear plain statement of fact with no interpretation needed to the rest of God's word that we MUST have the SON in order to have the Father, then we can clearly see that the TRUE God in both of these verses are speaking ONLY of the FATHER and that the ONLY WAY to the Father and to obtain ETERNAL LIFE is to be IN the SON having BOTH the Father AND the SON.
Consider the CONTEXT of 1 John 5:20 which clearly teaches us that being IN the SON places us IN Almighty God the Father. Please read 1 John 4:15 where we are taught in the word of TRUTH to confess that of belief that Jesus is the SON OF God.
“Whosoever shall confess that Jesus is the SON OF God, God dwells IN him, and he IN God.”
So then, when we are IN the SON by CONFESSING that Jesus is the SON OF Almighty God, then we are IN the Father the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God.
Let us move on to the next part of this article.
Holy Spirit is God: Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16 (The One who
indwells is the Holy Spirit - Romans 8:9; John 14:16-17; Acts
I totally AGREE that the ETERNAL Holy Spirit is ALMIGHTY God HIMSELF the ONE TRUE and ONLY ALMIGHTY God who ALONE has always been and ever shall be ETERNAL without beginning nor ending. The Bible clearly teaches us the God IS SPIRIT and that THE ONE TRUE God who cannot be SEEN by mortal man is the one who ONLY has IMMORTALITY. Again please read the study “THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE FATHER !” for all the verses that clearly teach us that there is but ONE SPIRIT and but ONE God who alone is the FATHER.
Scripture shows that the Holy Spirit is subordinate to the Father and the Son, and the Son is subordinate to the Father.
I agree most definitely that the SON is SUBORDINATE to his God and Father, but nowhere in scripture are we clearly taught that the Father is THE GOD OVER his Holy Spirit. But rather it truth many verses make it clear to us that the Holy Spirit IS the FATHER and that the SPIRIT is everywhere. Thus it is PART or an EARNEST of God himself being sent to perform the WORK much like our brain tells our ARM to lift something up. Our arm is NOT our whole being being told to do something yet is a sense our arm is a PART of our body. Our arm is SUBJECT to our whole being, but our arm is NOT a distinctly different being apart from us making our arm and our self being two different beings.
And in like manner as the arm of the human body obey the MIND of the body so is it when we picture God as being SPIRIT and being everywhere, then we can understand that the MIND of God speaks to a PART of HIMSELF and then that PART of God's very own self same being performs what the MIND of God is directing that PART of God to do. We do NOT have to make the Holy Spirit to be an IMPERSONAL FORCE of power that is used by God. Nor do we have to make the ONE Eternal SPIRIT to be a SEPARATE distinct person apart from God. Remember that God IS Spirit and there is but ONE Spirit. Therefore the INTERPRETATION of the Holy SPIRIT being a SEPARATE and DIFFERENT Spirit from Almighty God the Father who is SPIRIT would make TWO SPIRITS and this CONTRADICTS the word of TRUTH that teaches us that there is but ONE SPIRIT.
This is an internal relationship, and does not deny the deity of any person of the Trinity. This is simply an area which our finite minds cannot understand concerning the infinite God.
I totally agree that the ONE SPIRIT is indeed DIVINE in nature. God IS SPIRIT and there is just ONE SPIRIT. The SPIRIT is called ETERNAL in Hebrews and we know that the Holy Spirit is INVISIBLE and cannot be SEEN by mortal man. We also know that ONLY the ALMIGHTY has always been IMMORTAL or ETERNAL and that that there is but ONE TRUE God. So then, in truth Almighty God the Father and his Holy Spirit are NOT two separate distinct persons, but rather the ONE ETERNAL SPIRIT IS the FATHER, who is most definitely DIVINE in nature.
Concerning the Son see: Luke 22:42; ( This verse teaches us that the Son has his OWN will which he made SUBJECT to his God and Father's WILL to die on the cross. This most definitely proves Jesus being subordinate to his God and Father, but this verse does NOT prove that Jesus was FULLY the DIVINE ALMIGHTY God in the flesh and fully a human being at the same time.) John 5:36; John 20:21; 1 John 4:14. (again all these verses and many more absolute prove that Jesus is SUBORDINATE to his God and Father, but they do NOT prove that Jesus HIMSELF was fully a DIVINE being in the flesh. Again I want to point out that I fully believe that Jesus came out from God being conceived in the womb of the virgin Mary by the spoken word of God. In other words, I believe and teach that Jesus IS Almighty God INCARNATE. However, I teach a SOUND BIBLICAL teaching of God INCARNATE as opposed to what the main stream churches teach. Please read the study "WHAT DOES GOD INCARNATE MEAN?")
Concerning the Holy Spirit see: John 14:16; 14:26; 15:26; 16:7 and especially John 16:13-14.
John 14:16; 14:26; 15:26; 16:7 and especially John 16:13-14 are all speaking of God sending us ANOTHER comforter, or helper, or teacher, which in truth is an EARNEST of HIMSELF his very own self same SPIRIT in PART being sent to DWELL IN us.
I can see the argument of the Holy Spirit HEARING and then teaching us what he HEARS. So from WHOM does the Holy Spirit HEAR seeing that the ONE ETERNAL Spirit who is the ONE TRUE God. Does is hear from the SON seeing that the Holy Spirit IS the Father?
Well to me much like the whole body COMMUNICATES to ITSELF so does the Father SPEAK to his very own self same SPIRIT or body of God, if you will, in order to show the analogy between the human body communicating to ITSELF and Almighty God speaking to his OWN selfsame SPIRIT who is present everywhere.
Then when this verse speaks of the Spirit NOT speaking of himself this means that the Father who is DWELLING IN us will always glorify his SON and NOT himself. God IN us wants us to HONOR his SON even AS we honor the Father. And if we do NOT honor the SON, then we do NOT honor the Father either.
I totally agree that Almighty God is the SOURCE of all including being the source that brought forth his only begotten Son into being where the Son never existed before EXCEPT in the MIND and PLAN of Almighty God to one day have a Son. But again I do NOT believe that God is a "trinity".
As far as the SON being the agent that is used by God or through whom creation is maintained I have to DISAGREE. Please read the study “EPHESIANS 3:9-11---DID JESUS CREATE ALL THINGS?” for all the scriptures that clearly show us that Almighty God HIMSELF created all things FOR his SON Jesus where his SON Jesus was the PURPOSE for all creation.
For now we will just briefly look at the above verses given as proof text in this article.
1 Corinthians 8:6 says,
“But to us there is but ONE God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom (The Greek word translated as BY here also mean FOR. So in truth the correct translation should read FOR whom) are all things, and we by him.”
Also please notice that this verse clearly and plainly IDENTIFIES the ONE true God as being the FATHER. Please read the study "IS JESUS ALMIGHTY GOD?" and decide for yourself after considering the WHOLE of God's word.
The next verse John 1:3 used as a proof text for God being a trinity says,
“All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”
Again the word translated as BY here also means FOR, but this does not agree with the rest of this verse going on to say and WITHOUT him was anything made that was made unless one would add some words for clarification like many translators do such as, "All things were made FOR him, and with having him in mind was not anything made that was made." So then, like any other unclear verse where the translator ADDS words to make sense of the verse one could add that WITHOUT having his SON in mind was not anything made that was made and this would agree with the rest of God's word.
I have no problem with this understanding or interpretation seeing that it AGREES with the rest of God's word. However I myself see that the main subject in the CONTEXT of this verse is Almighty God himself who was in the beginning where the LOGOS or the SAYING was WITH THE God where ALMIGHTY God HIMSELF is the actual creator creating all things BY his LOGOS, his SPOKEN WORD. And WITHOUT Almighty God HIMSELF SPEAKING FORTH his LOGOS not anything was made that was made. In other words, ALL things were created by Almighty God HIMSELF by his SPOKEN WORD, his LOGOS, his SAYING. Please read the study "JOHN 1:1---THE WORD WAS GOD !" for a deeper understanding of what this highly controversial passage of Scripture truly means in the LIGHT of the WHOLE word of God.
Colossians 1:16,17 is speaking of both the first creation and the NEW creation. This first half of the first verse is speaking of Almighty God creating all things FOR his SON Jesus having his future Son in MIND before the foundation of the world. The second half of this verse is speaking of Jesus being the BEGINNING of God's NEW creation where ALL NEW creations are BY and FOR Jesus the SON OF Almighty God. Jesus is the FIRST BORN from the dead. Jesus is the FIRST human being who has been GIVEN life in himself even as the Father has life in himself. In other words, Jesus is the BEGINNING of God's NEW creation to inhabit the NEW heavens and the NEW earth wherein ONLY righteousness shall dwell.
“For by (should have been translated as Because FOR) him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers (which is speaking of Almighty God creating what is now FOR is SON Jesus): all things were created by him, and for him: (is speaking of God's NEW creation where Jesus is the BEGINNING of this NEW creation where Jesus is the one who made it all possible to become a NEW creation in Jesus Christ and FOR Jesus Christ.)
17. And he is before (or preferred above) all things, and by him all things consist.”
All the NEW creation consists BECAUSE of Jesus OBEYING his god and father to suffer and die on the cross for the sins of mankind so that WHOSOEVER BELIEVES on Jesus shall NOT perish but have eternal life in the NEW world to come. We LIVE because Jesus LIVES. Without Jesus becoming obedient unto death on the cross there would be NO NEW creation of God. Please read the study “EPHESIANS 3:9-11---DID JESUS CREATE ALL THINGS?” for all the verses and literal translations that fully explain in detail what I just said above.
Now as far as Jesus being the AGENT so to speak that THROUGH WHOM Almighty God made salvation available for WHOSOEVER of BELIEVES that Jesus is the SON OF God who died for their sins I do agree. Please read the study “TITUS 2:13---WHO IS OUR SAVIOUR GOD OR JESUS?”
I do agree with this in the sense that God HIMSELF is using HIMSELF to do all these works.
An Infinite God cannot be fully described by finite illustrations.
I totally agree with this statement. No analogy gives the true COMPLETE picture of Almighty God. But I do disagree that ALL of God DWELLS IN us as believers, because the Bible plainly states that we have been given an EARNEST of his Holy Spirit. An EARNEST is a down payment or a PART of the whole and NOT the WHOLE.
The Bible also teaches us that Jesus is the express IMAGE of God. Please read the study “WHAT DOES GOD INCARNATE MEAN?” which thoroughly explains in detail HOW Almighty God HIMSELF LITERALLY became a HUMAN BEING putting off ALL his divine nature to LITERALLY become a MAN. When one truly understand that Jesus came OUT FROM Almighty God as a created HUMAN being who was BEGOTTEN of God on a certain day in time clearly showing us that Jesus had a BEGINNING as the Son of MAN then you will understand that YOU as a believer NOW have the SAME ANOINTING DWELLING IN YOU to do the SAME works that men saw Jesus do THROUGH the SAME ETERNAL Spirit who DWELT IN him and NOW DWELLS in YOU. This is NOT VAIN deceit as the doctrine of the trinity that misleads Christians to wrongly believe that ONLY JESUS can live with out sin and do the works of God. Jesus clearly and plainly taught us that the works he did WE shall do ALSO, but how many Christians have you heard say things like "I cannot do that ONLY Jesus can live without sin or ONLY Jesus can heal the sick?" Please understand that I am NOT pulling Jesus down, but rather lifting YOU UP to know WHO you truly ARE in Jesus Christ.
Instead of focusing on the Trinity, try to focus on the fact that God's greatness and nature are infinitely higher than our own. “Oh, the depth of the riches of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable his judgments, and his ways past finding out.!” (Romans 11:33) The Bible only instructs us to believe Now and understanding will come later (I Cor. 13:9-12)
“For we know in part, and we prophesy in part. But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away. When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things. For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face:
now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known”.
This is how most every study I have read on the trinity ends by saying that the trinity is a MYSTERY past finding out.
In truth it is GIVEN for us to KNOW the deep things of God according to 1 Corinthians 2:10-16.
“But as it is written, Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man, the things which God has prepared for them that love him.
10. BUT God has REVEALED them unto US BY his Spirit: for the Spirit searches all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11. For what man knows the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? Even so the things of God knows no man, but the Spirit of God.
12. Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, BUT the spirit which is OF God; that we might KNOW the things that are freely GIVEN to us of God.
13. Which things also we speak, NOT in the words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Ghost teaches; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.
14. But the natural man receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15. But he that is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. (Do not let any man JUDGE you and tell you that you are NOT saved if you do NOT believe in the doctrine of the trinity using John 8:24 to try and prove that you are DEAD is your sins if you deny that Jesus is ALMIGHTY God or YAHWEH HIMSELF. Please read the study “JOHN 8:24-YOU SHALL DIE IN YOUR SINS IF YOU DO NOT BELIEVE THAT I AM HE!”)
16. For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him (speaking of those in the world)? But WE have the mind of Christ.” (or the SAME Eternal Spirit who DWELT IN Jesus WE now have DWELLING IN us as believers)
Special Summary Insert:
Christians believe God is three persons in one: God the Father, God the Son & God the Holy Spirit.
NO! Only SOME Christians believe in the doctrine of the trinity. It is made clear by some in the main stream church that ONLY those who believe and teach the doctrine of the trinity are TRUE Christians. And I highly DISAGREE with this false teaching that obey MUST believe in the doctrine of the so called trinity IN ORDER to be SAVED! This is no better than the Roman Catholic Church killing true born again Christians for DENYING the doctrine of the trinity.
The Christian doctrine of the Trinity states the unity of these three persons in one divine Being known as the Godhead.
Again ONLY those who believe in the doctrine of the doctrine or the trinity teach that the Godhead is THREE persons in one God, which again CONTRADICTS the clear word of God that plainly states that the FULLNESS or ALL the Godhead DWELT IN the SON OF Almighty God.
The doctrine of the Trinity is INFERRED from numerous Bible passages, but it is NOT stated explicitly in the Bible.
I absolutely agree that there are absolutely NO clear, plain, simple verses that neither clearly states nor teaches us that God is a so called trinity.
We are baptized with the Holy Spirit (Matthew 3:11, Mark 1:8, Acts 1:5, 11:15-16)
I totally AGREE! Every believer has been given the indwelling of the Holy Spirit, but not all believers have experienced the FULLNESS of God's Holy Spirit giving them the utterance of speaking in other tongues. I myself was saved for almost six months before I saw this truth and was FILLED with the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in other tongues. Please read the study “THE POWER AND THE AUTHORITY OF THE BELIEVER!”
The Ontological Trinity is the Christian teaching that God consists of three simultaneous, eternal persons: the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit. Each of the three persons are co-equal in their attributes and nature, but differ in how they relate to the world and to each other.
The word “ontology” means the branch of PHILOSOPHY that deals with being. In other words, the study by man related to the existence of being. In Christianity it obviously means HOW did Almighty God the Father ALWAYS EXIST and WHAT was his BEING? Was Almighty God DIVINE in nature having always existed WITHOUT beginning and without ending? Obviously the Bible without a doubt teaches us that Almighty God the Father has always existed from all eternity past as an IMMORTAL being, which we call DIVINE or DEITY.
And we also know from the Bible that the Holy Spirit is ETERNAL and that Almighty God IS SPIRIT and that there is just ONE Spirit, which consequently teaches us that the Holy Spirit IS Almighty God the Father, as in, ONE and the SELF SAME BEING as the Almighty God the FATHER. Again please read the study “THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE FATHER!” for all the scriptures.
But what of the SON OF Almighty God the Father? Has Jesus ALWAYS been an ETERNAL being WITH God from all eternity past as some teach? Please read the study “DID JESUS PREEXIST AS THE SON OF GOD?”
The Economic Trinity deals with how the three persons in the Godhead relate to each other and the world. Each has different roles within the Godhead and each has different roles in relationship to the world (some roles overlap)
Now I do not believe that the author of this article is actual saying that there are literally TWO trinities, but rather that there are two METHODS of studying the doctrine of the trinity, which try and define different aspects of the so called “trinity”. At first I was wondering if there was a CONTROVERSY even among trinitarians and they were DIVIDED on the defining of their doctrine. But after looking up these different ways of study to define what the trinity means I do not see a DIVISION among trintarians as such that they are fighting each other and being strongly divided. However in my research I have found many DIFFERENT definitions of the doctrine of the trinity, which tells me that not ALL trinitarians are in total agreement about their doctrine.
The teachings of Jesus support the doctrine of The Trinity
Again while it is true that SOME verses like the above quoted references do HINT or allude to THREE there are other verse that EXPRESSLY speak of ONLY TWO, Almighty God the Father, AND his SON Jesus. Again please read the study “THE HOLY SPIRIT IS THE FATHER !” for all the verse that clearly and plainly teach us of ONLY TWO.
My main issue with the doctrine of the trinity is actual began with the statement in the doctrine of the trinity that Jesus is CO EQUAL with Almighty God the Father.
Then as I study the subject for myself I also began to see the error of the doctrine of the deity of Jesus which states that Jesus IS FULLY God in the flesh and fully man at the same time, in that, Jesus is fully ALMIGHTY God HIMSELF in the flesh and a human being at the same time having TWO natures, one DIVINE and the other human and having TWO WILLS one being the will of Almighty God the Father and the other being his OWN human will.
So as I kept on asking God how can this been the Holy Spirit opened my eyes to more and more verse that clearly and plainly contradicted these man mad teachings. This lead me to do even a more in depth study on Jesus being CO ETERNAL with Almighty God preexisting for all eternity past WITH the Father as God the Son as some teach. And through that study I found many errors of translation which completely exposed the error of Jesus preexisting from all eternity past as God the Son.
And it the course of all those studies God opened my eyes to the truth that there are ONLY TWO and NOT three as those who teach the doctrine of the trinity dogmatically demand that there be in order to support their doctrine of “TRINITY”, which means THREE. For without THREE there can NOT be a doctrine of the “TRINITY”.
Now I omitted this brothers name and email, because I do NOT give out any names or addresses of those who write to me. He closes with the following.
May God richly bless you and strengthen your faith in His Word.
There are three Persons, of the same essence and power, who also are co eternal, the Father the Son, and the Holy Ghost/Spirit
The ONE passage of Scripture that states this is I John 5:7-8. And it is natural that the textual critics say that it should not be there because it is not found in some of the more recently found manuscripts.
Please read the study “1 JOHN 5;7----THESE THREE ARE ONE !” for an in depth study on this verse leaving it just as it reads in the King James Version of the Bible.
One final NOTE:
Sometimes when the infinite God conveys His thoughts to finite man, mystery is the result. The Trinity is one of those mysterious truths
Again this is how most every teaching on the doctrine of the trinity ends by basically saying that we must believe in the doctrine of the trinity even though it cannot be explained in simplicity to be understood by all and therefore it is one of those MYSTERIES of God that are past finding out by finite man.
I happen to disagree with this THEOLOGY of cherry picking certain verses out of context to use to try and prove that God HIDES his deep things from us. Again please read 1 Corinthians chapter 2. Earlier I only quote part of this chapter, but this time I want you to see that the apostles SPOKE to us the MYSTERIES of God NOT as so called MYSTERIOUS teaching that could NOT be understood, but rather they spoke or taught to us the mysteries of God to our UNDERSTANDING of the deep things of God.
“And I, brethren, when I came to you, came not with excellency of speech or of wisdom, declaring unto you the testimony of God.
2. For I determined not to know any thing among you, save Jesus Christ, and him crucified. (this is the heart of the Gospel that MUST be believed in order to be saved)
3. And I was with you in weakness, and in fear, and in much trembling.
4. And my speech and my preaching was not with enticing words of man's wisdom, but in demonstration of the Spirit and of power:
5. That your faith should not stand in the wisdom of men, but in the power of God. (this is my heart's cry for all the churches of God that they KNOW the POWER of God so that they will DO the same works men saw Jesus doing through the power of the Father dwelling IN him. Know you not that YOU are the temple of Almighty God and that God himself DWELLS IN YOU to EMPOWER you to live free from sin and do the very SAME works that Jesus did dear child of God?)
6. Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect (every time you confess your sins you are made PERFECT again in the sight of God just as if you had never sinned so repent QUICKLY if and when you fall into sin and are snared by the devil. God's desires us to remain in this PERFECT state of living free from sin so he can use us. Please read the study ""HOW TO LIVE YOUR LIFE FREE FROM SIN !"): yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
7. But we SPEAK the wisdom of God in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: (this verse is NOT talking about teaching MYSTERIES, but rather REVEALING the mysteries or more precisely the SECRETS of God, which God kept HIDDEN from his ENEMY Satan the devil.)
8. Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. (in other words, IF the devil knew before hand that it has always been God PLAN for him to crucify his Son Jesus, then the devil would have never crucified the Lord of glory knowing that it would seal his own fate. Please read the study ""UNDERSTANDING WHY?", which answers question like why does God allow evil the exist.)
9. But as it is written, Eye has not seen, nor ear heard, neither have entered into the heart of man (obviously from the context man here is referring to the carnal Christians and unsaved heart of men that the secrets of God have not enter), the things which God has prepared for them that love him.
10. BUT God HAS revealed them unto US by his Spirit: for the Spirit searches all things, yea, the DEEP THINGS of God.
11. For what man knows the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? Even so the things of God knows no man, but the Spirit of God. (In other words, OUR inner man of the spirit KNOWS what our MIND is thinking and in the same way the eternal Spirit that IS God knows the MIND of God, who then tells US by speaking to our spirit which speaks to our minds revealing to us the truth)
12. Now we have received, NOT the spirit of the world, BUT the spirit which is OF God; that (or so that or in order that) we might KNOW the things that are freely GIVEN to us of God.
13. Which THINGS ALSO we SPEAK (in other words, the things which God REVEALED to the apostles they SPOKE or TAUGHT to US), not in the words which man's wisdom teaches, but which the Holy Ghost teaches; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. (whenever the apostles taught the revelations of god they always put forth the written word of God to SHOW those whom they were teaching that God himself had PROPHESIED what they were teaching to come to pass. In other words, that were REVEALING that the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus was WRITTEN in the very word of Almighty God comparing what God was bringing to pass with what he had already spoken centuries before they came to pass.)
14. But the natural man (again speaking of carnal Christians and the unsaved) receives not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
15. But he that is spiritual judges (or literally closely examines) all things, yet he himself is judged of no man. (This means that when one who speaks ONLY the word of God and he is closely examined by another, then he will NOT teaching in error. This also means that the one who examines all things will KNOW that he of she is teaching the WHOLE truth and nothing but the truth and therefore cares not that he or she is judged by others.)
16. For who has known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But WE have the mind of Christ.”
The "who" here in this verse to me is again speaking of the carnal Christians, the unsaved, and those Christians who have NOT closely examined the WHOLE matter truly listening to ALL sides of the controversy. But THOSE who have indeed searched out the WHOLE matter comparing spiritual things with spiritual have the mind of Christ.
That is to say that the mind of the Holy Spirit dwelling in us is the SAME mind of the holy Spirit who dwelt in Jesus leading and guiding us into all truth.
Now I will be the first to tell you that my nature is meek and lowly and that I do NOT like any confrontation. So when the Holy Spirit began showing me the errors if interpretation of the doctrine of the trinity by NOT comparing Scripture with Scripture I did NOT want to share this truth, because I KNEW that I would be persecuted, rejected, and shunned as a heretic by my peers.
But none the less God prevailed and he persuaded me to found this website here at AmatterOfTruth.com to share what he has revealed to me. Like Paul and the early apostles I was faced with the question should I teach what please MAN and receive glory of MEN or should I teach what I know that God himself has shown to me?
So then, I must obey 1 Corinthians 9:16, which teaches us that we are compelled to share God's word not matter what persecution it may bring. We are persecuted for the words' sake.
“For though I preach the gospel, I have nothing to glory of: for necessity is laid upon me; yea, woe is unto me, if I preach not the gospel!”
Thanks for reading and may God bless you richly as you continue to seek the truth of the whole word of God.
Your brother in our Lord Jesus Christ,
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